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Laying the windward mark
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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6644 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jul 10 at 1:13pm
Originally posted by GK.LaserII

...I didn't fancy a hoist, gybe and drop on such a short leg. The previous leg was too tight for the spinny...

Its one of the subtleties of course setting... In club racing at least you should aim to have only one hoist and drop per lap if the crew make the right decisions (and wind shifts haven't made a nonsense of your course). Reason is that the hoists and drops are the things that really take it out of the more mature forward hand energy wise. Its why a lot of folk drop out of crewing the faster boats when the big birthdays start rolling around...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jul 10 at 1:28pm

Originally posted by JimC

  Its why a lot of folk drop out of crewing the faster boats when the big birthdays start rolling around...

I'm not in a particulary large or fast boat and I still know what you mean

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patj View Drop Down
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Posts: 640 		Post Options Post Options   Quote patj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 2:03pm
One solution for clubs would be that used at Frensham Pond where they have fixed club marks and a course pre-defined by the "experts" for each possible wind direction and sometimes strength. So there is the NE course, the S course and so on and each gives a good mix of beats, reaches and runs. All the RO has to do is identify the prevailing wind direction.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 2:15pm

Originally posted by patj

One solution for clubs would be that used at Frensham Pond where they have fixed club marks and a course pre-defined by the "experts" for each possible wind direction and sometimes strength. So there is the NE course, the S course and so on and each gives a good mix of beats, reaches and runs. All the RO has to do is identify the prevailing wind direction.

That does seem a sensible option on lakes, provided there are no other objecting water users. Can't do it on the sea (where we are) unfortunately.

That aside, here's some 1959 pictures you might enjoy patj:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/37279784@N02/sets/7215761726850 4336/
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Barty View Drop Down
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Posts: 240 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Barty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jul 10 at 1:06pm

Originally posted by gordon

beat should be set downtide (looking up the beat) of the sailor's wind

Surely this should be beat set uptide (looking up the beat)?  If the windward mark was downtide then you would just sail on the tack that lets you crab across to the mark.......or am I not understanding Gordon's comment?? 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jul 10 at 4:46pm

....down tide.... in the direction the tide is going. Here's a rough and ready doodle

(They boat going for the right hand mark has cheated and gone the wrong side of the mark.....there is a protest going in )

 

done"

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gordon View Drop Down
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Posts: 1037 		Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jul 10 at 6:52pm
That's right, and 2nd leeward mark should be further downtide of 1st leeward mark.

Gordon
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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6644 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jul 10 at 7:57pm
Originally posted by gordon

That's right, and 2nd leeward mark should be further downtide of 1st leeward mark.Gordon

Grief yes, That's never occurred to me before... It means, effectively, its impossible to set a true Windward/Leeward course in cross tide... In order to get a true beat *and* a true run you'd need to have a triangular course with a spreader mark at the windward mark which would give an uptide leg long enough to cancel out the downtide drift during the run in order to set a true run...
Failing that the interesting question is whether its better for the beat or the run to be one sided. In a handicap class I'd say its more important for the run to be true!
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Barty View Drop Down
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Posts: 240 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Barty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jul 10 at 11:13pm

I assumed you were talking about a port handed course not s'bd.

In your sketch, realistically the right boat would drop down to the left with the tide and be on the left hand windward mark in one tack.  If the windward mark is up tide they would not be able to get to it without tacking.....does that make sense?





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Barty View Drop Down
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Posts: 240 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Barty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jul 10 at 11:14pm
No it doesn't make sense because they  could just bear off and go stright into the tide...doh
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